We’ve heard the old adage “A penny saved is a penny earned.” For every dollar you don’t have to pay in taxes, you get to keep for yourself. The ideas Ken Sullivan of Tax Matters Solved will be sharing with you today just may give you some bragging rights on keeping more dollars in your pocket. I will be sharing some stories from hall-of-fame mortgage clients and how they saved money owning real estate.

What do YOU want to accomplish with YOUR mortgage? I can make the process easy for you on a home purchase mortgage or refinance for debt consolidation. Let’s stay connected! Call me at 901 482-0354. Email me at Jo@JoGarner.com Subscribe for weekly Real Estate Mortgage Shoppe podcasts with show notes www.JoGarner.com

Host: #JoGarner #MortgageExpert www.JoGarner.com

Special Guest: #KenSullivan #TaxMattersSolved TaxMattersSolved@gmail.com

(1st segment 9:06am to 9:15Am)

LET’S GET STARTED…(Jo) (Good morning, Memphis! Welcome to our internet listeners and podcast listeners across the 50 states! . Today is August 26th, 2023. Call us in the studio while we are live at 901 535-9732.You’re on Real Estate Mortgage Shoppe. I’m your host, Jo Garner, Mortgage Loan Originator. You can connect with me at www.JoGarner.com. Our general topic: TAX PREPARATION STRATEGIES FOR REAL ESTATE INVESTORS.

Introducing Ken Sullivan, Tax Matters Solved LLC

In the co-host chair for the first time we have Ken Sullivan He owns and operates Tax Matters Solved, LLC, a boutique tax resolution firm specializing in IRS Collections, Appeals and Audits. Sullivan is an Enrolled Agent of the Internal Revenue Service. He is admitted to practice in the US Tax Court. You always say if we get the dreaded IRS letter saying we owe them lots of money, our next call is to you. (Ken has about 1 minute to introduce himself and talk about his services )

(Jo) What would your answer be if I asked you “what is the biggest bill you pay?”

So many people answer quickly that it is their mortgage. But, as a mortgage loan officer, the biggest bill I see my clients paying is to pay TAXES.

Today, I am encouraging you to connect with your Certified Public Accountant (your CPA) to relook at ways you can use your real estate to shelter even more of your income. Call Ken Sullivan of Tax Matters Solved if you got the dreaded IRS letter in the mail Don’t face the IRS alone.

Some of the ways I have seen my mortgage clients keep more of their income is by using their real estate

  1. Avoiding capital gains tax when they sell a home where they have lived for 2 years over the last 5 years For single mortgage clients I have seen them shelter up to $250K for and $500K from married couples

  2. Some of my self-employed borrowers use a tax write off for business use of their home

  3. I know real estate investors who have set up self-directed IRAs for their real estate transactions to build up wealth and delay paying taxes on their profits, freeing up more funds to invest

  4. Don’t forget about the like-kind 1031 exchange tool that has recently been in the news


Financing to Buy a Home with Funding Secured on a Different Asset


  1. There are many cases and situations, like with a real estate investor we will call Molly. She wanted to buy a home that was in such poor condition that the mortgage company would not accept it as collateral. Molly found a way to get some money to pay cash for the fixer-upper. We did a mortgage secured on one of the other homes Molly owned that was in good condition. She used the cash out refinance funds from that mortgage to pay cash to buy the fixer-upper property.

MAKE YOUR PLAN. LET’S WORK YOUR PLAN. IF THE DEAL WORKS FOR YOU TODAY, LET’S DO IT TODAY. I can make the mortgage process easy. Connect with me at www.JoGarner.com You can email me at Jo@JoGarner.com or call me at (901) 482-0354

(Jo) Ken Sullivan of Tax Matters Solved can certainly talk about strategies we can use to save on taxes using our real estate investments. (Kenl starts covering some of his topics until 9:15 am to be continued after break)

You’re on Real Estate Mortgage Shoppe. I’m your host, Jo Garner, licensed mortgage loan originator. What do YOU want to accomplish with your mortgage? What do YOU want to accomplish with YOUR mortgage? I can make the home purchase or debt consolidation refinance EASY for you. Connect with me at www.JoGarner.com When we come back, you will be hearing Ken Sullivan of Tax Matters Solved. See you back in just a moment.

2nd segment is after 9:15 break from about 9:18Am to 9:30 AM break

2nd segment after 9:15 breakIt’s time for the Look Back Memphis Trivia Contest Our Look Back Memphis Trivia Contest SPONSOR is Mike Aukerman of National Property Inspections.(901) 674-6868 Before you buy, call NPI, Mike at National Propety Inspections. Mike is giving away a $50 gift card to the first caller with the correct trivia answer t o our Trivia Contest. If you know the answer, call us on the air at (901) 535 WREC. (901) 535 9732. Material supplied by Jimmy Ogle, notable Memphis historian www.jimmyogle.com

Our Trivia Question: WHO AM I?

Garner # 34 11/28/14

Riverside Drive

Question: Sometimes I am closed by nature, and some time by man. What street am I?

Hint: My land did not exist for centuries!

Hint: A part of me was once the city dump!

Hint: Parts of me have also been known by the names of Arkansas Street or Fulton Street.

Final Hint: I am now one of the most pedestrian friendly streets in Memphis.

Answer: Riverside Drive. Having been around for less than a century, Riverside Drive opened in 1935 to connect Downtown Memphis to the Harahan Bridge, whose automobile portion had opened in 1917 for the Broadway of America (Highway 70 from San Diego to New York City). Memphis had grown from eight cars in 1904 to almost 52,000 in 1930 and the city population had grown to 250,000. Prior to 1935, the Mississippi River came to the bluffs and there was no road, no Tom Lee Park – just the industrial port of Memphis leading up the warehouses (now an area with condos and large homes with majestic views of the river and sunset). The Cobblestone Wharf was Memphis’ major industrial river port (until 1952). The area was so forsaken that it became a prime location for the City dump materials! Part of the drive would flood annually and had to be sandbagged. The Delta Queen formerly landed at the south end of Riverside Drive at a spot known as John B. Edgar Point. A sidewalk was finally constructed in 2002!

In 1990-91, a major public works project occurred that permanently stabilized the Mississippi River channel, the bluffs, Riverside Drive and added 20 more acres of park land to Tom Lee Park. In 2014, a temporary Cycle Track plan was laid out on the southbound side of the drive for bicycles, joggers and pedestrian on a trial basis. The Memphis In May International Festival uses the area for its three major events annually and Riverside Drive is also an important link in numerous road races and marathons, such as next week’s St. Jude Memphis Marathon. Riverside Drive now has its own restaurant – Riverside Bar & Grill at Beale Street Landing, which is also a major terminal for overnight passenger vessels on the Mississippi River, as well as local cruises.



Are you in fact, for tax purposes in the statutory sense as deemed by the IRS, a Real Estate Professional?

Teague, US Tax Court Summary 2023-16 – Tax payer deducted $23,967 in total rental real estate losses from three cabins in Maine. IRS determined that TP actively participated in RE activity. However, because of  the income phase out rules, only $1,540 of the loss was allowed.


Do you keep an accurate contemporaneous mileage log? What is the standard Mileage Rate? References – Rev. Proc. 2010-51; Notice 2021-02; Announcement 2022-13 and Notice 2023-03

For Tax Year 2023 the following rates apply – Business Rate per mile 65.5 cents per business mile – Medical and moving rate per mile 22.0 cents per mile (moving expenses suspended tax years 2018 – 2025 unless member of the Armed Forces on PCS Orders – Charitable rate peer mile – 14.0 cents per mile Depreciation rate per mile 28.0 cents per mile – BE CAREFUL that records are kept accurately and contemporaneously – US Tax Court Found in Craddock, T.C. Summary 2023-4 the record showed TP Schedule C (Self Employment) an W2 Employee income showed same vehicle in tow different places miles apart on same day.


When and what are you required to report as income and/or expense? Generally as a cash basis Tax Payer, you must include in gross income all amount you receive a rent, any payment received for use or occupancy of property – 1) tenant pays water and sewer bill for your rental property and deducts from normal rent – under terms of lease tenant does not have to pay this bill (carefully read your lease) 2) tenant, while you’re out of town, pays for furnace repair that’s not working and deducts from rent payment – based on facts in each example include in your gross income the rent payment and the repair and the utility bill then you may deducts the costs as rental expenses. Property or Services in lieu of rents……. painter, handyman, plumber, electrician, landscaper


Why keep records? Monitor income, track basis of property, prepare tax return, support items on tax return. Choose a recordkeeping system that suits your business and clearly shows your income and expenses. Keep records the length of time necessary to prove the income or deductions on a tax return. Generally the tax records should be kept seven (7) years. Remember there is no statute of limitations on fraudulent transactions and the IRS can re-visit a suspected tax return at will.


What expense items may I as an owner deduct? How do I document the expense? Expenses my include mortgage interest (not principal payments), property tax, operating expenses, depreciation and repairs. Report Rental Income and Expenses on Form 1040 or 1040-SR, schedule E, Part I. See Form 4562 to figure depreciation to enter on line 18. If expense exceeds income, you may have losses that are limited a Passive Activity Losses or At Risk Limitations – property that may have personal use will also be limited.


Not really…… Good records will substantiate income and loss AND will support any expense that any be denied by the IRS. Certain expense require compliance with travel rules in Chapter 5 of Publication 463. Remember documentation of items challenged at audit will best be supported by receipts, canceled checks or bills, statements are weak documentation without receipts that state the exact nature of the expense and to what income producing property the expense is connected.


The first step in the process (COLLECTIONS) will be a routine letter generally computer generated called a CP (computer prepared) Letter (sent by ACS) asserting a challenge and asking for additional information. DO NOT ignore the correspondence from the IRS. The correspondence will be escalated if ignored. Best practice is to employ a professional to assist you in responding and DO NOT talk to or respond to the IRS without representation. The second step will be Examination – generally a telephone conducted interview. The third step will be an Audit – generally a field audit (not good) or an office audit (TP or representative goes to IRS Office). Should tax payer not resolve tax matters, IRS will begin serious collection activities including liens on personal and business property and assets then actual levies (and perhaps foreclosure and taking of property). Once this stage is reached there is a tax payer option to move the matter to Appeals. finally after all options are exhausted and a Notice of Federal Tax Lien is issue that Tax Payer has a time limited opportunity to Appeal to US Tax Court.


If a Revenue Agent (Special Agent) arrives at your place of business and presents credentials and is armed, call an Attorney and do not discuss any matter without presentation. This interaction means the IRS considers this a criminal matter beyond the civil matter status of most tax matters.


(3rd SEGMENT 9:35 AM)


What are some strategies people use to save money?

  1. Figuring how to work smarter-not harder RAYMOND RIDLEY’S STORY

(Jo) There are so many ways to enjoy owning your home and one that brings a great deal of satisfaction is not even financial. A home is your castle. It is the neighborhood where your children will grow up, where family stories take place and are retold for years during family get-togethers. But there financial benefits to owning your home too.

Raymond Ridley (not his real name), licensed real estate broker and full-time investor, has successfully owned, rehabbed and sold over 500 homes and apartment units. Raymond started out as a hard-working realtor, earning a lot of money from his sales, but having to shovel half of it over to Uncle Sam for taxes. Working harder was not the answer. He had to figure out how to work smarter. Raymond says, “ I have probably made more money in real estate than anyone in this room, and I have probably lost more money in real estate than anyone in this room. When someone makes an income, he has to be on the job every day to earn his pay. When he builds wealth by buying real estate, the tenants continue to pay him rents—even when he is on vacation.”

Raymond presented six reason to enjoy owning real estate and here they are:

  1. Cash flow on rental property is income per month minus the mortgage payment including taxes and insurance. Income – PITI= Cash Flow. If you plan to keep the rental house a long time, a great tool to use is the 30 year fixed rate mortgage. If you have a 30 year mortgage, you enjoy a principle and interest payment that stays the same for the life of the loan. You give yourself a raise every time you raise the rent because your profit margin is getting bigger and bigger rent income increases but your mortgage principle and interest payments stays the same.

  2. Appreciation is the rate the house value increases every year. Raymond pointed out that there is a direct correlation between cash flow and appreciation. Cash flow is usually less per month in areas with higher appreciation rates.

  1. Real estate can provide a wonderful Tax Shelter where an investor can make a six- figure income and pay zero taxes. Raymond confessed that sheltering almost all of his income from taxes was where he learned to work smarter and not harder. To shelter $50,000 per year in income, an investor would need approximately $1,000,000 in real estate. Raymond prefers having 10 houses valued at about $100,000 rather than 30 houses valued at $30,000. With 10 houses he only has 10 tenants with 10 possible problems instead of 30 tenants with the possibility of 30 problems.

  2. The fourth aspect of real estate involves Amortization. With each mortgage payment the principal balance is being paid down at a faster pace. This builds equity in the house as the mortgage is paid off. The investor may choose to borrow against this equity later to purchase something else.

  3. The fifth aspect of real estate is Leverage. Real estate is one of the few investments that allow the investor to borrow almost the entire value of the investment without a large lump sum of cash.

  4. A sixth bonus is the opportunity for family relationship bonding while working together in the real estate investing business.

What do YOU want to accomplish with YOUR mortgage? MAKE YOUR PLAN. LET’S WORK YOUR PLAN. IF THE DEAL WORKS FOR YOU TODAY, LET’S DO IT TODAY. Connect with me at www.JoGarner.com. Email me at Jo@JoGarner.com or just call me at (901) 482-0354.

Real estate has been known in past history to be a terrific hedge against inflation. The Federal Reserve keeps talking about going up multiple times over the next year on their rate, which indirectly pulls mortgage rates with it over time. L


Jackson Andrews (not his real name) made quite a good income in the securities business. He invested in the stock market but wanted to own some income-producing real estate properties to balance out his investments. He could use some real estate expenses to lower his overall tax bill from the aIRS.
The problem Jackson had was his work schedule. He had the money to put down on the investment real estate and his income was high enough but Jackson did not have time

The solution? Jackson found a realtor that knew how and where to scope out bargains. He hired a property manager too. Most of the bargains were homes that needed quite a bit of repairs. Since the homes would have to be in good shape to get a standard fixed rate mortgage, Jackson borrowed against other assets like getting a loan on his 401K. We even did a cash out refinance on one of his other properties to give him enough cash to buy more and more houses at bargain prices to fix up and keep or resell at a profit.

What are some things you can do to help self-employed people who take tax write-offs but need to show enough income to qualify for a mortgage?

Several of my real estate investor customers are self-employed. Some of them have done so well with their real estate Investments that they live on the income coming from their properttes. Here are some tips to real estate investors who are self-employed.

  1. There are certain tax write-offs that can legally be added back to income for mortgage qualifying purposes, like depreciation on cars or trucks or equipment and a number of other items. Just because the front page on the tax return doesn’t show enough income from the business doesn’t mean there isn’t income hiding in the BACK pages of the tax return that a good mortgage loan officer can add back. Susan and I start at the back of the return when we calculate income for a self-employed person.

Add back .25 cents per business miles if standard mileage deduction was used.

C once in a lifetime write offs. In order to add back once-in-a-lifetime expenses to qualified income for mortgage purposes, the mortgage regulations will require that you clearly document that the expense was a one time occurrence

Example: One of my real estate investor clients had been getting a mortgage from me to buy rental property for years. This time she handed me the tax return and said, “Not sure you can help me this time. My tax return shows a lot more expenses this time because we bought a fixer-upper, gutted it and redid the plumbing, and other once-in-a-lifetime renovations.

For this customer, she brought me receipts clearly identifying the items she purchased like sheetrock, cabinets, kitchen and bathroom appliances, flooring . Since her reciepts had listed the name of the project with the property address, we were using for collateral

The amount of once-in-a-lifetime receipts tied to that one

What do YOU want to accomplish with YOUR mortgage?

I can make the home purchase or refinance loan easy for you.

It is EASY to get started. Just call or text me at 901 482-0354

Email me at Jo@JoGarner.com

Or connect at www.JoGarner.com

4th segment following 9:45 am break about 9:48 to 9:56 am


Ken Sullivan of Tax Matters Solved LLC shares a tip:


If a Revenue Agent (Special Agent) arrives at your place of business and presents credentials and is armed, call an Attorney and do not discuss any matter without presentation. This interaction means the IRS considers this a criminal matter beyond the civil matter status of most tax matters.

Jo Garner’s mortgage tip:

Call me and let’s discuss using the non-traditional, DSCR mortgage for your real estate investment purchases. The only income used is the lease income on the subject property. You still need good credit, verifiable money to pay for down payment, closing costs and other, good title and the house to be in good repair

The loan program is not as stringent has other programs on income verification. No tax returns are required.

Minimum down payment 20%

30-year fixed rate

Connect with me at (901) 482-0354 Jo@JoGarner.com www.JoGarner.com


Talk Shoppe offers free networking & education to anyone interested in real estate or in business or in health and wellness. Talk Shoppe meets every Wednesday 9A-10A CT at Concorde Career College 5100 Poplar the 1st floor in the Memphis Clark Tower and also on zoom. Go to www.TalkShoppe.com and click the Events tab for the link to get into the event online. This Wednesday August 30, 2023 come equip, engage and empower YOUR business at Talk Shoppe’s Mastermind session based on the book “Think and Grow Rich” by Napoleon Hill

Talk Shoppe could not offer the free educational networking events free to our community without some very giving sponsors. Thank you to Talk Shoppe sponsor Reverend Jo Rook, Director of the Healing and Wellness Ministry at Church of the Harvest in Olive Branch, Mississippi. Join Reverend Jo Rook at the healing conference is going on right now August 26th, 2023 at Church of the Harvest 14707 MS-Highway 302 Olive Branch, MS.

Thank you to Talk Shoppe sponsor, Peggy Lau of Club Seacret. Peggy can tell you how to earn first-class vacations as you go through your normal routine of living everyday. Contact Peggy Lau of Club Seacret at 901 289-0747.

Thank you to Kim Halyak of Cooper Young Garden Walk in Memphis, TN. Get to know some great gardeners. Get some great garden ideas too. Connect with Kim Halyak of Cooper Young Garden Walk cooperyounggardenclub.org

Subscribe to get weekly Real Estate Mortgage Shoppe podcasts with show notes at www.JoGarner.com



QUOTE CORNER “A fine is a tax for doing wrong. A tax is a fine for doing well.” Peg It Board



  1. Don Lawler of Brand-Aid (videographer with Storytellers Memphis) (901) 485-3027.

  2. Santa Claus in Memphis, TN book Santa through his agent Chuck Bohannan hohoonthego50@gmail.com

  3. Mark McLaurine of Refrigeration Unlimited 901 216-7782

Transition Music: “After Taxes” by Johnny Cash; “Running Bare” by Jim Nesbitt; “Keep Your Head Up” by Andy Grammar; “Memphis” by Johnny Rivers for the “Look Back Memphis Trivia Contest”


An essential guide for real estate professionals and their customers.

Now on Amazon and Barnes and Noble



Ken Sullivan is an experienced and polished entrepreneur with presentation and training skills as well as day to day operational and managerial skills who is committed to leadership development and team building.

His v
olunteer background and small business experience over forty-five years are important to him and his family. He exemplifies the traditional work ethic and is a spark plug for any organization.

Educated in Public Schools, Sullivan graduated the University of Mississippi. Sullivan joined the U.S. Navy during the Vietnam War.

His professional career includes diverse professional experiences including small business, governmental service, medium sized finance, real estate sales and investment plus property management. He owns and operates Tax Matters Solved, LLC, a boutique tax resolution firm specializing in IRS Collections, Appeals and Audits. Sullivan is an Enrolled Agent of the Internal Revenue Service. He is admitted to practice in the US Tax Court.

In a volunteer capacity, Sullivan has held many offices in the National Exchange Club. He is Charter Member of the Exchange Club of Millington, Tennessee. Sullivan served as Regional Vice President representing Tennessee and Mississippi. Sullivan has served as a Trustee on the National Exchange Club Foundation. He was elected as Treasurer of the National Exchange Club in Phoenix at the 112th National Convention in July 2023. He has served on the Board of the Millington Area Chamber of Commerce as Secretary/Treasurer. Sullivan has always been involved in educational activities in his business, professional and volunteer careers.

He and his bride of 52 years reside in Memphis and maintain a family home in Madison, Mississippi. They travel weekends to spend time together. They are members of the First United Methodist Church in Millington. They have a Veterinarian daughter, a heavenly daughter who was a Registered Nurse and four grandchildren.



www.JoGarner.com (901) 482 0354 jo@jogarner.com twitter @jogarner NMLS# 757308

(currently working with Cardinal Financial Company, Limited Partnership NMLS #66247 equal housing opportunity 2645 Appling Rd 102 Memphis, TN 38133 ) Online loan application https://online.cardinalfinancial.com/#/p/apply/jogarner

www.cardinalfinancial.org for licensing info www.nmlsconsumeraccess.org/EntityDetails.aspx/company/66247 “Whatever YOUR personal priorities are, my job is to help you get the mortgage terms that will give you bragging rights when you talk about it and help you score on hitting your goals .”

As a mortgage loan officer, my job is to help you get to the benefits you want from your financing terms. What is most important to you? I can help you find the financing terms that will help you get to what you want. What is your comfort level on a house payment? How much are you comfortable paying down,? What type of financing do you need to get the house you want to buy or refinance?

Different clients have different priorities in life—some are buying their first home with very little down payment funds. Some are recovering from medical challenges, divorces or preparing to send children to college and some are embarking on a long term goal of buying properties to build rental income.”

Jo Garner is a mortgage officer with extensive knowledge in tailoring mortgages to her customers who are refinancing or purchasing homes all over the country. She offers conventional, FHA, VA or other loan programs for refinancing and purchases.

Jo can help you look at rent vs buy, when it makes sense to refinance, how to get the best deal on your home purchase financing.

Jo Garner has been in the real estate/financing business for over 25 years.  She grew up in West Tennessee and got her start in real estate in Portland, Maine where she first began her real estate career. She received her real estate education from the University of Southern Maine  and was personally mentored in San Diego, California  by Robert G. Allen, author of Nothing Down, Creating Wealth and The Challenge.

On moving back to West Tennessee in 1987, she went into business buying and selling discounted owner-financed notes secured on real estate.  In 1990 Jo went to work for a residential mortgage company and has been a mortgage loan officer for over 25 years.  Her goal is to offer excellent, affordable service to her customers, tailoring the loan programs to the specific needs of her clients. 

In addition to her work in the mortgage field, Jo Garner  is the primary sponsor and founder of Talk Shoppe in Memphis. www.TalkShoppe.com Jo Garner also host the radio show Real Estate Mortgage Shoppe airing on News Radio AM 600 WREC and iHeart Radio with podcasts and show notes published on www.JoGarner.com Pick up Jo Garner’s book on Amazon or Barnes and Noble “Choosing the Best Mortgage-The Quickest Way to the Life You Want”